____twoism

Damn straight. First one on me too. That goes for all of you. Well, y'know, not at the same time. I'm not made of money

Mexicola wrote:Damn straight. First one on me too. That goes for all of you. Well, y'know, not at the same time. I'm not made of money

Hahahaha. Second round on me. Cheers!

Cheers, 747.

I hope to have the determination to see myself there however grim things appear now and, then, again later. I appreciate the words.

You're an inspiration, 747!

Thanks, fellas.

Sobering thoughts that puts things in perspective for me and also gives me some relief:

My brother was recently declared NCR (not criminally responsible) in court and is to be permanently hospitalized in a highly secured mental institution.

For nearly the last 2 decades he has had the overgeneralized right to refuse any assistance or medical help for his illness. He has an extreme case of paranoid schizophrenia, enough so that the head psychiatric doctor in Canada's capital city general hospital, who had been there for decades, said that he has the worst case of mental illness he's ever seen. Even so, because he had not been caught in the act of serious criminal activity he has kept his right to tell anyone who would offer him help to "piss off".

He has had no effective ability to take care of himself and has multiple times lived in the streets, eating out of garbage cans, sleeping in parking lots and so forth. That is not a pleasant way to live, as you can imagine. It also puts an incredible amount of stress on his family. When not on the streets, he spent his disability payments on alcohol and drugs as a method of self-medicating. These habits continued to destroy his mind yet further. He'd been in and out of jail for more or less minor things. He had also been in and out of hospitals as a temporary forced visit. He would fake his recovery, leave and go back to his rough habits.

My family had reached out to many different places, trying to find help. For example, a way for someone to help him manage his money so he wouldn't blow his paycheck in a day or two on vices that prevented what medication he was taking to take effect. That's if it was during a time he was agreeing to take meds and wasn't having delusions about the " government's hidden agenda and experiments" that was behind the medications he was prescribed. We reached out in many ways, but due to his delusions he didn't trust the much needed help.

Why would he accept such help when he 100% believes a crazy delusion? That it's actually a couple years in the future and everyone is pretending it's not because he had been shot and in a coma for a few years while people ran experiments on him. No one will admit the "truth" to him, there are cameras everywhere and people posted to monitor him and he doesn't know why, so he trusts no one.

You might as well ask a man in a coma to give consent to wake him up and then say: "well, we tried."

This past spring, my brother's delusions had gotten severe enough that he was walking around his apartment complex with an ax, threatening to kill everyone he saw. The police arrived and he barricaded himself in his apartment. Shortly thereafter, mental health services showed up and convinced the police not to use lethal force. After 9 hours of negotiations, he came out and was taken to a hospital/jail.

No one got hurt. My brother has now lost his right to refuse help and will be well taken care of. In time and with luck, I may get to speak with the brother I once knew. The brother who is not constantly paranoid, angry, suspicious and under intense stress. The brother I had as a kid who was nothing but kind, funny and generous.

Last I heard, he's convinced that he was created by a Russian experiment and that our parents are actually his adoptive parents. He met with Putin and Obama who gave him a Russian passport to fulfill his purpose. He was supposed to receive further instructions from his adoptive parents, but of course, my folks are real and have no instructions because all of this in his head. So he's pissed that he not only can't fulfill his purpose, but now has enemies in his family that are hiding important information from him.

Silver lining: Things can get rough in my own mind at times. I can always remember that I'm far from how bad it really can get and that pulls some weight of my mind, allowing for a quicker recovery.

So, yup. I felt like organizing my thoughts and getting that off my chest. If you read that wall of text, congratulations. Now go get some fresh air. Maybe find a tree somewhere in a forest that looks thirsty and have a whiz of a time.

22 days sober, first day of no cravings. I was sober for about 60 days last year but relapsed.

I started filling a spreadsheet to track my cravings. I programmed it with ChatGPT so that it pulls a numeric value and converts it into a color code in a calendar view. It's actually helping.

Alcohol really is atrocious stuff. I hope I manage to sober up permanently this time around. Maybe I should do an anti-alcohol PSA at some point. I'm not sure if there's actually any reason for anyone to drink it ever.

Way to go Altruizine! Show that alcohol who is boss!

Alcohol is indeed vicious, and what is worse, almost a social norm. I can't drink alcohol anymore because of my medication but even that is pretty difficult when everybody is shoving booze in your face. I can't imagine what that would be like if I was addicted to the stuff, but sounds tricky indeed!

But we got this. We are in control! Here we determine our own fate.

Thanks. It's a bit weird to call myself addicted but that'd be accurate since this has been a struggle. I can even show you the data. "That's it I'm giving up" means I made a decision to relapse but changed my mind before the purchase. Also there's another practice I'm trying out which I included in the screenshot but I'm not going to elaborate on that :DD



It's not really alcohol that I crave though, just feeling okay for a while and alcohol just mildly helps with that. I'm sort of pro-cannabis, pro-mushrooms etc. but I'm not using even them. Somebody once said those compounds are biochemically like a key that fits neatly in a lock and alcohol is like taking a hammer and breaking the lock.

Luckily alcohol use is declining in European countries on average but I don't think it has a reputation for being out of style yet. I wouldn't be surprised if that happens in the future

Good job, Altruizine!

I kicked alcohol a while ago as well, 1 1/2 years sober now.
It takes some serious willpower to overcome an addiction, but as long as you have the right motivation, it's absolutely doable.
I had some strong cravings when I first quit, but as of now I rarely get them at all.
And if I do, it helps to remember how I was at my worst, and how I'd never want to be that person again.

Keep at it, you can do this!

Thanks. I feel like I'm more or less in the clear now. Genuinely no cravings at all for 4 days. It's pretty cool how the graph shows the decline in cravings and I remember how I used to feel during those first weeks. Alcohol definitely induces some chronic brain fog and anxiety that takes at least a month to clear up.

I was already exercising and eating pretty clean but one of the important things was to exercise even more and more rigorously, eat even cleaner (all "processed" stuff I eat now are like, cold pressed olive oil and such)

Hey y'all. Been a hot minute hasn't it?

I've been sober since August 2024. Gave up booze for Lent in early 2024, liked the change so much I stuck with it until visiting Juneau Alaska, toured the Alaskan brewery and then went right back to no drinking.

Sure helps not feeling sick all the time, or wondering what I regret the next day. Couldn't swing a healthy relationship with alchohol, decided it was best to just beat the addiction. Glad I'm on the wagon.

turquoise70 wrote:Hey y'all. Been a hot minute hasn't it?

I've been sober since August 2024. Gave up booze for Lent in early 2024, liked the change so much I stuck with it until visiting Juneau Alaska, toured the Alaskan brewery and then went right back to no drinking.

Sure helps not feeling sick all the time, or wondering what I regret the next day. Couldn't swing a healthy relationship with alchohol, decided it was best to just beat the addiction. Glad I'm on the wagon.

Good work! Its indeed nice to be able to remember things again.

Oh man. I slipped up with my sobriety after 36 days, for pragmatic reasons. I had been putting off doing something for too long and it was about to cause problems so I bought some wine and got it over with. I remember those first days when I thought I'd never get over the need to drink but after 20 or so days it transitioned into "I don't need to drink to feel fine but I'm still curious about having a good time". That's tolerable and easy to distract oneself from and my motivation to do that actually grew with time! From barely having motivation at first and very much second-guessing the decision to liking sobriety. I didn't even particularly want that wine.

Not the greatest move. The longest stretch I've managed since that relapse has been 15 days. I suffer from depression but only when I'm alone which is a lot. Don't have any friends currently that I'd care to meet.

It "only" takes 20 days to get back to that state I reached... great.

Anyway, I got through the "ah this is nonsense torturing myself to be a little healthier and save a little money" phase already once. Might as well do it again... but I needed to post about it somewhere

Also sharing some good info for addicted people. Things are different for different people but... it's almost a biological certainty that it gets easier with time

Ah well, I'm drunk again. I can't for the life of me understand why people are as horrible as they seem to be.

I guess I could elaborate but it would be of no use.

Stop blaming others!!! You are responsible for all your own anguish!!!

Yeah okay. I'm assuming you would tell that to a woman in the 20th century about "being oppressed".

You're comparing your situation to that???

Ahh... I guess? Maybe it's not as bad but I think any instance of mindless discrimination should be comparable to some extent. I feel like I'm sincere, suffering, benevolent and I'm met with violent indifference and hostility

Incredible to read through every experience on this thread.

I hate alcohol as much as it is possible and yet it's like savia. It somehow, in small(ish) doses facilitates me as a functional being while shoving me downward and shipwrecking my life, health and relationships-wise. I have a long and boring history of strategies and stances, but even after years of sobriety I have never been able to truly beat the fucker. It's the non-stop psychological craving that corrals me, the recurrent dreams about drinking that pin me down, leaving me vulnerable to ubiquitous temptation.

I try not to overthink it anymore. Just living on the assumption I'm barrel-bottom case and doing my best not to hurt anyone or myself, a continuous and straining check.
I know things could be much worse, so appreciating each day against eating pangs is no small thing in my book.

Widmerpool wrote:Incredible to read through every experience on this thread.

I hate alcohol as much as it is possible and yet it's like savia. It somehow, in small(ish) doses facilitates me as a functional being while shoving me downward and shipwrecking my life, health and relationships-wise. I have a long and boring history of strategies and stances, but even after years of sobriety I have never been able to truly beat the fucker. It's the non-stop psychological craving that corrals me, the recurrent dreams about drinking that pin me down, leaving me vulnerable to ubiquitous temptation.

I try not to overthink it anymore. Just living on the assumption I'm barrel-bottom case and doing my best not to hurt anyone or myself, a continuous and straining check.
I know things could be much worse, so appreciating each day against eating pangs is no small thing in my book.

You're traumatized (wow sounds serious, pretty much everyone is but you are more so than average). A small dose of alcohol partially restores the way you're supposed to feel by default sober.

I've looked into this quite a bit because I can't function sober either. The situation has got so bad that I can't hold down a job currently unless something changes. In fact, getting employed because my family pushed me into it when I thought I wasn't ready traumatized me further and the situation got worse. I've figured out a lot and tried to reach people that I could collaborate with and was met with reactions that were mostly beyond retarded.

There's no "quick fix" but you could try your luck with TRE and psychedelic therapy. This is not a foolproof method and you'll probably need a big dose which will be a difficult experience. There have been cases when depressed people (often accidentally) took a massive overdose of psychedelics and it lastingly cured their depression

Uhh what's TRE? What are you talking about? Explain it to me?

If you can't look things up independently you're probably beyond hope. You will need to do work yourself

Btw sorry if that post was hard to read. Not because it was too emotional but because of weird formatting. I've had people complain about that. I could spell check with AI but I refuse to do that. I'm actually pretty bright but the trauma dumbs me down.

I think now's a good time to stop posting. I feel terrible, like literally violently hurting or killing myself but I'll probably be fine. I'm also drunk but that doesn't invalidate what I'm saying, I was sober when I had the thought multiple times that I should posting, I'm just wasting my own and others' time and not contributing anything meaningful. See you in another 13 years, maybe.

Altruizine wrote:There's no "quick fix" but you could try your luck with TRE and psychedelic therapy. This is not a foolproof method and you'll probably need a big dose which will be a difficult experience. There have been cases when depressed people (often accidentally) took a massive overdose of psychedelics and it lastingly cured their depression.

This is dangerous advice, and I'm saying that as a psychonaut who has learned and cleansed a great deal of my pain during difficult shroom trips, and consider mushies my "little ol' friends" (though in the end it was CBT that actually helped, and I have seen people completely transform into positivity through EMDR as well). Not every mind is equipped for tripping balls, and in some can actually trigger psychotic and/or schizophrenic episodes. Not saying it can't ever help, but definitely don't just take a massive dose of psychedelics in hopes it will cure your depression, especially without doing the research, or without a proper sitter that knows what to do when things go south, or doing it in a triggering, overstimulating setting where it will do more harm than good.

Alcoholism, and similar life-destroying addictions like gambling or long-term opioid usage, are sometimes more a symptom than the disease. They form the illusion of an escape. But an escape from what? What/who do you fear?

Cupz wrote:

Altruizine wrote:There's no "quick fix" but you could try your luck with TRE and psychedelic therapy. This is not a foolproof method and you'll probably need a big dose which will be a difficult experience. There have been cases when depressed people (often accidentally) took a massive overdose of psychedelics and it lastingly cured their depression.

This is dangerous advice, and I'm saying that as a psychonaut who has learned and cleansed a great deal of my pain during difficult shroom trips, and consider mushies my "little ol' friends" (though in the end it was CBT that actually helped, and I have seen people completely transform into positivity through EMDR as well). Not every mind is equipped for tripping balls, and in some can actually trigger psychotic and/or schizophrenic episodes. Not saying it can't ever help, but definitely don't just take a massive dose of psychedelics in hopes it will cure your depression, especially without doing the research, or without a proper sitter that knows what to do when things go south, or doing it in a triggering, overstimulating setting where it will do more harm than good.

Alcoholism, and similar life-destroying addictions like gambling or long-term opioid usage, are sometimes more a symptom than the disease. They form the illusion of an escape. But an escape from what? What/who do you fear?

I'll respond even though I said I'd stop posting because someone actually responded which is rare.

I'm well aware of the dangers. When I started tripping on shrooms I gradually increased the dose. The mild ones were fine until suddenly I felt like I had gone psychotic. That time I had my cousin to accompany me who was an excellent sitter and knew exactly what to say.

That being said, having had these experiences, people are always looking for the shortcut, the easy way out. That's just my experience and this is probably the only option. Even though I felt somewhat crazy I recognized that this state could've been utilized for some lasting change. I wasn't discouraged from continuing, just felt like I needed better planning. Being past mid-20s greatly reduces the risks because your brain has gravitated towards comfort its entire life and is more likely to find a way to return to past comfort + integrate the new insights = stonger comfort. Just start gradually, have a sitter.

though in the end it was CBT that actually helped

Exactly, you don't necessarily have to go to formal therapy but you'll need the instructions which the psychedelics allow you to properly integrate. Some people have had luck without them, it's as if the mind has got tangled up but has the knowledge to untangle itself, the process just needs to be triggered with exogenous substances. However even if that's the case, it's a good idea to still seek therapy and explicit instructions beforehand

Alcoholism, and similar life-destroying addictions like gambling or long-term opioid usage, are sometimes more a symptom than the disease. They form the illusion of an escape. But an escape from what? What/who do you fear?

Glad you said "sometimes" because this doesn't apply to me. I'm just not willing to go through this myself but it has nothing to do with being "afraid" of something. It's purely practical. Humans are gregarious creatures, we've developed as a collective, we're dependent on each other. That's why solitary confinement works for even the most antisocial people to destroy them mentally. That's why narcissists are deathly afraid of being left alone and become the most damaging individuals in existence because they'd rather die than not feel needed by others.

Yeah, maybe I am "afraid" of something then? Let's say you have to bake some bread. You have all the ingredients besides flour. You feel like you shouldn't do it until you get flour.

No no, what are you afraid of? Just bake the damn bread

Yeah.. I guess I'm afraid of baking some inedible lump of nothingness instead of actual bread?

Cupz wrote: Alcoholism, and similar life-destroying addictions like gambling or long-term opioid usage, are sometimes more a symptom than the disease. They form the illusion of an escape. But an escape from what? What/who do you fear?

You know trauma is usually caused by being assaulted by shit people. Maybe the logical conclusion of that is being "afraid" of fully experiencing the assault which becomes a postponed task stuck in their nervous system. Still, your question doesn't necessarily make a person trace down this answer but it implies something more internal and independent.

This is the case for me at least. I was never traumatized, I was happy but recognized that the state was fragile and I could become easily traumatized. Then someone came along and slapped my shit big time