____twoism

Treefingers wrote:Anyone got any advice for a dude like myself who has a tendency to get feeling miserable and hopeless a lot in his early twenties? I could possibly use some.

My caveat here is that if someone had suggested this to me in my early 20's I would have rolled my eyes and made a jerk off hand motion, but have you ever tried practicing mindfulness? I had sort of a nervous breakdown a year and a half ago and it's something that's helped me a lot.

There's a really practical guide book to the practice called "mindfulness in plain english" which is pretty straightforward and low on the "new agey" factor if that's something that turns you off.

I just got so sick of my anxiety destroying my mind that I turned to stuff I'd previously written off, like mindfulness meditation and hypnotherapy and making little lists of things I'm grateful for and all that sort of thing. It's not a cure all, but it's made a real difference and I think just the small amount of discipline it took me to do those things helped me feel like I have more power over my own life.

rainier wrote:

Treefingers wrote:Anyone got any advice for a dude like myself who has a tendency to get feeling miserable and hopeless a lot in his early twenties? I could possibly use some.

My caveat here is that if someone had suggested this to me in my early 20's I would have rolled my eyes and made a jerk off hand motion, but have you ever tried practicing mindfulness? I had sort of a nervous breakdown a year and a half ago and it's something that's helped me a lot.

There's a really practical guide book to the practice called "mindfulness in plain english" which is pretty straightforward and low on the "new agey" factor if that's something that turns you off.

I just got so sick of my anxiety destroying my mind that I turned to stuff I'd previously written off, like mindfulness meditation and hypnotherapy and making little lists of things I'm grateful for and all that sort of thing. It's not a cure all, but it's made a real difference and I think just the small amount of discipline it took me to do those things helped me feel like I have more power over my own life.

This sounds great. I am on so many meds that the only good feeling I can have physiologically is through alcohol. Needless to say the aftereffects are devestasting on my mental health. The usual advice can't apply to me because of where I live.

Take a walk? Where? It's all concrete. Find a hobby? No time (Idon't make time). Spend time with friends? (Have none, I live in a small Japanese town most of the time.). Drugs? (Fuck that, Japan is very strict.). My meds have taken all emotion away from everything. I have to force myself to listen to music which I have lost interest in. I do enjoy playing Wii U with my kids when I see them, but I am no longer an avid gamer. I gave up DJ'ing years ago. I'm thinking it's my environment that is destroying me. But I can't leave my family behind and go back to Canada. I want to, but I know I will cry myself to sleep every night knowing I will never see my young 4 year old son again, who I love more than anything in the world. We don't even speak the same language but it doesn't matter. He is an extention of me. I want him to be everything I wasn't able to be. Yet, if I stay here (Japan), it will destroy me. I'm almost finished with it all now.

I find exercise helps way more than medication, really the obvious solutions are the best ones. it's just hard to face it once you're in a negative cycle.

rainier wrote:

Treefingers wrote:Anyone got any advice for a dude like myself who has a tendency to get feeling miserable and hopeless a lot in his early twenties? I could possibly use some.

My caveat here is that if someone had suggested this to me in my early 20's I would have rolled my eyes and made a jerk off hand motion, but have you ever tried practicing mindfulness? I had sort of a nervous breakdown a year and a half ago and it's something that's helped me a lot.

There's a really practical guide book to the practice called "mindfulness in plain english" which is pretty straightforward and low on the "new agey" factor if that's something that turns you off.

I just got so sick of my anxiety destroying my mind that I turned to stuff I'd previously written off, like mindfulness meditation and hypnotherapy and making little lists of things I'm grateful for and all that sort of thing. It's not a cure all, but it's made a real difference and I think just the small amount of discipline it took me to do those things helped me feel like I have more power over my own life.

I think I am sort of interested in that kind of thing... I should note despite my general aversion to new ageyness (down to finding a lot of it a tad trite, to be quick about it). What does interest me though is the whole idea that the entirety of the world as we know it is simply our mind's perception and interpretation of it... and so therefore part of feeling positive is going to involve working within the mind, so to speak.

I was reading a bit about David Lynch's work with transcendental meditation (interestingly, him and Haruki Murakami (and postmodern culture in general, I guess) furthered my interest in the philosophy of environment being perception). It interested me because there's someone with an interest in this sort of thing, who is - as can be seen through his films - not one to reject the fact that there's darkness within humanity and within human nature and society, contrasting my general problem with new ageyness being that I feel it's often too quick to focus entirely on positivity and outright reject the idea that negativity does exist and is a part of life.

I hope that makes sense, and cheers for the recommendation. I might look into it.

I've never been diagnosed with or given medication for depression or anxiety, but I've certainly experienced many of the symptoms of both on a low and consistent level for periods of my life and while I would never try to offer a solution to what can be a physical illness in a much more severe form than I have experienced, there are physical and mental changes that I have attempted that have had positive effects for me.
Diet is something that I think is often overlooked in health generally – I find that my physical health has a huge impact mentally – I had long periods where I came home from pretty undemanding office work exhausted, drained and went straight to bed, only to repeat and make the cycle worse with copious weekend escapist drinking. Alcohol, processed foods, loads of carbs led to mood swings, energy crashes, weight gain. After trying any amount of stuff, a 'paleo' lifestyle finally made the most difference – my energy returned and mood levelled out, niggling health issues disappeared.
There's not much point in me going into detail about what paleo means – you may already know and besides there's plenty of internet resources, suffice to say it turns much currently conventional advice about 'healthy' diet and exercise on its head, but made perfect sense to me. I can't really explain the huge difference just this simple change of diet and lifestyle made to my mental health.
At the same time I was attempting to make mental changes, to overcome tendencies I've always had to dwell on the past, worry about the future and obsess about people's views of me. I found unlikely inspiration in a philosophy book called 'Straw Dogs' by John Gray that on the face of it is grim reading, but offers a view that I thought I could apply on a personal level – the idea of abandoning thoughts of 'progress' and instead concentrating on 'living skillfully'.
I guess in simple terms this means forgetting about big pictures, big plans and past consequences and focusing on small things, the details of simply living in the present. For me this meant things like cleaning up my diet as above, getting rid of a lot of material objects, simplifying, improving, but without becoming too obsessive about it – enjoying the moment, easy things like playing with my son or making a meal. Trying to live my daily life in a sense of 'flow', like that sense where you are reading a book or playing an instrument, the external world kind of disappears and time flies by. Another part of this was getting outside much more and really trying to experience nature rather than just passing through it. In essence I suppose, instead of obsessing internally about external issues over which I had no control, I immersed myself in the present which, to an extent, led to concerns about the past and future being pushed away.
Another thing that this idea of 'living skillfully' gives me in a strange way is security. I know, certainly with my diet, that I have something that works for me, something that I can return to if things go awry.
While this isn't a solution to past or future problems , I think it is something that gives me a more solid and steady base to face things from.
I know this is a bit of a ramble and maybe seems a bit clinical and logical (I guess that's my personality type) and probably not applicable to a lot of people in worse situations than me, I'm just offering it up as my experience in the hope that there may be something useful there.
Good luck to everyone here in whatever situation you face.

Most the world's greatest music was inspired by depression, anxiety, or emotional pain. When the lights go off and you feel raw, lonely, and down, you are most in touch with the source of all things. Use those times to create from the depths of your soul.

The author Neil Gaiman said when you are depressed and hopeless, there is only one thing to do: "Make Good Art."

when it comes to depression and anxiety i would highly recommend:

- mindfulness/meditation
- eating healthy
- exercising
- getting creative i.e. learning an instrument, writing, practicing any artform, etc

saturdayindex wrote:Most the world's greatest music was inspired by depression, anxiety, or emotional pain. When the lights go off and you feel raw, lonely, and down, you are most in touch with the source of all things. Use those times to create from the depths of your soul.

The author Neil Gaiman said when you are depressed and hopeless, there is only one thing to do: "Make Good Art."

Repeating this for emphasis.

I'm 17 and i've been depressed on and off for about 2 years which is getting progressively worse and more constant over time. I'll probably go see a therapist in the holidays, although something about that scares me.

It's just kinda sad that i'll look back on my last few years of school as being the worst time of my life (well i hope it is).

I'm kinda new to the forums, so I hope that I'm welcomed in this thread.

I'm pretty heavily medicated for depression...Though it doesn't seem to work too well...
Have tried to kill myself before...See a doctor, a therapist, nothing helps.
Mostly loneliness, I guess. I really don't have any friends. Beat up in school all the time, ended up leaving to go to a private Catholic school, where I've spent a year and plan to go to another public school.

My parents take no initiative to care about my hobbies and such, so I'm at a loss for that. Really never have anyone to talk to. Maybe one friend who is an hour out, and he's 30 years older than I am. A lonely, pathetic thing, I am.

I've tried the diet, I've tried the exercise-nothing has ever helped. I've done it all.

akrotiri wrote:I'm kinda new to the forums, so I hope that I'm welcomed in this thread.

I'm pretty heavily medicated for depression...Though it doesn't seem to work too well...
Have tried to kill myself before...See a doctor, a therapist, nothing helps.
Mostly loneliness, I guess. I really don't have any friends. Beat up in school all the time, ended up leaving to go to a private Catholic school, where I've spent a year and plan to go to another public school.

My parents take no initiative to care about my hobbies and such, so I'm at a loss for that. Really never have anyone to talk to. Maybe one friend who is an hour out, and he's 30 years older than I am. A lonely, pathetic thing, I am.

I've tried the diet, I've tried the exercise-nothing has ever helped. I've done it all.

You're very welcomed in this thread, and in any thread on Twoism!

If nothing works, look at the source of depression. Let's do a little thought experiment: what's the opposite of depression? Vitality. When you are living from your true self, not the programmed, negative, depressed one, then you are overflowing with vitality.

Usually depression stems from a lack of love or validation in the formative years. The parents thing is difficult as they are generally supposed to be our main source of those things. My parents are similar, they have shown interest in very small doses over the years, were very controlling when I was young, etc. They key is to eventually be so self-actualized that you rise above all that. Over years and years of negative experiences and words being fed into your mind, it's difficult to do so but it's very possible. You can't change anyone else, but you can change yourself. You can't make your parents be interested in your hobbies--no one can change their parents. So there's no point in feeling sorry about it. Rise above your parents and stop feeling like you 'need' them to be interested. At this point, it's the ONLY solution. You might just have to detach from them. In fact I think detaching from one's parents emotionally is the beginning of true self-empowerment. You'll still have to love them though, despite what appears to be their ignorance.

The key to solving depression is to recreate your entire life from the ground up. New, positive friends, new, exciting hobbies, and new, unfamiliar places where you can safely express your new, positive persona. It's difficult to go from depression to happiness/vitality when you're surrounded by all the same things. Imagine walking into your friend's/uncle's/parents' place with a huge smile on your face and feeling better about life. They might not take you seriously and you'd fall immediately back into the old role you played with them. Roles stick around like that. You need change, you need space for your soul and mind to breathe. Traveling is a HUGE mitigator of depression, by the way.

To anyone in this thread struggling with depression, I suggest reading Psycho-Cybernetics by Maxwell Maltz, changed my life.

Went into the city this afternoon with two friends because my year 12 exams are over for the term. Spent the whole time wanting to jump into traffic so i just hung back while my friends talked to each other, i only responded with a few words whenever they tried to talk to me and then i left early because i physically couldn't do it anymore.

But hey at least exams are over.

the problem for me has always been the manic-ness. the ups and downs are inseparable from life but i always experience them on really far ends of the spectrum. i believe all the anxiety stems from OCD. my brain has always been wired that way. it was something before this, but for the past year, Eros relationship has been the topic of my compulsive thinking.

there's a good T.S Elliot quote, i think it was him who said: "anxiety is the handmaiden to creativity".

i tried medication for around three months around one year ago and it just made me numb and extremely drowsy... i'd take the anxiety and uneasy feelings over that any day.

for context i'm 22. i've read a lot of Ram Dass, Watts (The Wisdom Of Insecurity is the first book I read when the anxiety started effecting my responsibilities, incredible book), practiced a lot of yoga throughout the years... there is a lot of rhetoric in those cultures, on the surface, but beyond all that it's the real thing for sure. and all that stuff is incredible and given me essential insight, but there is no cure except that within yourself. even after years of immersing myself in these kinds of insights the brain will find a way to bring you back to a space you don't want to return to. because, the brain is plastic... so it can change for the better too, no matter how impossible it feels.

saturdayindex wrote:Most the world's greatest music was inspired by depression, anxiety, or emotional pain. When the lights go off and you feel raw, lonely, and down, you are most in touch with the source of all things. Use those times to create from the depths of your soul.

The author Neil Gaiman said when you are depressed and hopeless, there is only one thing to do: "Make Good Art."

Reminds me of a complementary quote by Kurt Vonnegut that the purpose for art is to grow the soul.

rainier wrote:

Treefingers wrote:Anyone got any advice for a dude like myself who has a tendency to get feeling miserable and hopeless a lot in his early twenties? I could possibly use some.

My caveat here is that if someone had suggested this to me in my early 20's I would have rolled my eyes and made a jerk off hand motion, but have you ever tried practicing mindfulness? I had sort of a nervous breakdown a year and a half ago and it's something that's helped me a lot.

There's a really practical guide book to the practice called "mindfulness in plain english" which is pretty straightforward and low on the "new agey" factor if that's something that turns you off.

I just got so sick of my anxiety destroying my mind that I turned to stuff I'd previously written off, like mindfulness meditation and hypnotherapy and making little lists of things I'm grateful for and all that sort of thing. It's not a cure all, but it's made a real difference and I think just the small amount of discipline it took me to do those things helped me feel like I have more power over my own life.

Any Mooji video on youtube. There are many Satsang videos that last 2 hours and even longer.

I'm in my mid twenties, had a few really bad panic attacks in last year or so, and I can really say with confidence that you must hit the bottom in order to see the bigger picture.
I'd be happiest if i could tell you it works instantly and it makes sense instantly, but I figured out that
there are many ways in which i define myself to myself, but the self stays intact.

I'm a bit stoned at the moment and i'm writing this mostly to myself, but be assured that Mooji will show you how to help youreself and much more, how to realize what you are.

Spending whole days on the couch, eating basically nothing all day, I feel terrible.

i just watched threads.

I manage to get 10 hours sleep and still feel tired all day, maybe it's because all I eat most days is a few snacks and whatever's for dinner. I'm no longer accomplishing anything or bothering to keep in contact with most of my friends anymore, I think that if i died it wouldn't really have much of an impact on anyone, all i really enjoy doing anymore is listening to music so that's basically what i do most of the time.
I guess some people care about me but it's not like i'm a big part of anyone's life. Sometimes I think about suicide and i usually tell myself the next day how stupid that would be but it terrifies me that those thoughts come up. I don't even know what i'm doing anymore, I'm pathetic.

Hmm, looks like I need to do this in 2 parts...

Christ, I've written and re-written this bloody post about 5 times now and it still never comes out right. It's a genuine shame that so many people on here are struggling with depression, especially as I've been there myself and can really empathise with how truly destructive it is.

For what it's worth, I want to re-iterate something that mentioned a couple of times before, and that's self realisation. I won't go into my own story because I actually don't feel it's helpful, It's important to try and fill this thread with as much positivity that you guys can come to when you may need it, suffice it to say I've been all the way (the almost never coming back kinda all the way) there and back with depression, and I've been "depression sober" for a few years now, so hopefully if anything about how I moved through it resonates with anyone here and can help, then I've done my part.

The self-realisation I had was that I didn't want to be depressed. Being depressed is shit. Like, really shit. All the external sources of help I'd turned to hadn't worked (meds, drugs, psychiatrists etc) so what was left? Me. This was something I had to do, which is fucking scary to realise that a) I had to make some really genuine life decisions and b) that I had so much power that I could change the world I lived in. So what did I do? I had to take a long hard look at the few friends I had and realise that a couple of them actually only reinforced all the negativity, so they had to go. The city I was living in was the city that I had lived my 20's in (the major period of depression for me), so I had to go, it was too ripe with triggers and associations that reinforced the depression, so I moved to another city. I'd had a pretty terrible relationship with my parents. They didn't know who I was, they didn't care about me, I hadn't seen them for years. That was a tough one because I had to accept that just because my parents didn't see the world the same way I did or love me the way I expected them to, didn't meant that they didn't. I was trying to force them to be someone they weren't and hated them for not bending to my desire. So first I had to make my peace with my part in all of the fucked up relationship, and then forgive them for not being the people I wanted them to be. I'd been a big fan of comfort eating an had a really low self opinion of myself physically. I felt so far out of my comfort zone I wanted to scream but I got myself in at a gym and started to make steps to change the body that I was so unhappy with.

I could go on but i think that should elucidate the point. Now I'm 35, have a job I really enjoy, living in a different country that feels full of opportunity, have a good relationship with my parents, only a couple of genuine friends but they are 100% in my corner and have got my back without a moments doubt and I shifted a bit of weight.

I'm not gonna pretend that I don't have the odd bout now and then, but my relationship with depression now is that it's a cathartic process: whenever I have a depressive episode it's to let me know that I'm moving on and shit that I've made a conscious decision to exorcise from my life is being removed, kinda like when you have a cold: the day you feel the shittest is when all the crap is being killed off and moved out of your body, and also alerts me to the things I still want to change and haven't managed to get round to yet.

I want to avoid saying "do this" or "try that" because there's already been a lot of good advice on here, and depression is such a personal thing that I feel a little uncomfortable trying to guess what may work for individuals, but if there's only one very important thought (see what I did there?) I can leave you with is that depression is NOT something you have to be powerless against for your whole life. The road through it is difficult but the rewards are immeasurable, and, to coin a phrase, nothing worth doing is ever easy.