Geiser

[Jonse]

Trying to buy copies of the old releases would somehow feel wrong

This.

Especially for a large sum of money, which meant that the person who got rid of it did it not because they felt the fans should hear it or something like that, but merely because their material desire outweighs their value of the tape.

Also, I feel like a fan owning one of the tapes would be wrong as well. If one of them for some reason (any of the old releases) ever came into my possession, I think I'd rip the thing to FLAC and then mail the thing to Hexagon Sun where it really belongs. Simply because if it got lost or something and fell into someone else's possession, they may try to sell it for a whole bunch of money, which is the shittiest thing people could do...and have attempted to do in the past, in fact.

[blue oyster cunt]

i dont think those old materials like Catalogue 3 or Acid memories really exists (but my sixth sense could be wrong...)

[hexagon son]

Had any of you ever thought of the notion of "royalties" and who would get them? BoC hasn't always just been the bros. Christ. and other artists have previously been involved in their work. It could be for legal reasons that these early releases aren't being released because they haven't been able to come to any agreement with the people formerly involved. It could also be that former members don't want these released into the public.

[zeoevil]

Had any of you ever thought of the notion of "royalties" and who would get them? BoC hasn't always just been the bros. Christ. and other artists have previously been involved in their work. It could be for legal reasons that these early releases aren't being released because they haven't been able to come to any agreement with the people formerly involved. It could also be that former members don't want these released into the public.

If they were ever commercially released then I would imagine that would mean all of that had already been taken care of. The unreleased albums had codes and two of them had re-releases in the 90's. In other words record companies just keep on reprinting old albums over and over again until they don't sell anymore. To this day you can buy Led Zeppelin albums anywhere and everyone involved in those albums keep getting paid. As far as I know that doesn't change unless someone throws a fit. Unless legal things are different in Scotland we would have heard about that if it had happened. Maybe someone could shed some light on this theory.

[harpoon dodger]

Someone on Twoism has gotta have them. no doubt.

I don't really know. If somebody on Twoism had them they'd probably have been leaked by now, I think.

I have been here a long time, and there's others here even earlier than that. Even though I'm not as active as I once was on these boards, I assure you if ANYONE on Twoism had copies of them we'd all know. Nice to dream, though....

[23degreesdream]

Someone on Twoism has gotta have them. no doubt.

I don't really know. If somebody on Twoism had them they'd probably have been leaked by now, I think.

I have been here a long time, and there's others here even earlier than that. Even though I'm not as active as I once was on these boards, I assure you if ANYONE on Twoism had copies of them we'd all know. Nice to dream, though....

I agree. I think if not a rip then confirmed sighting of the items - photo's etc.

I'm also surprised none of these items has surfaced for sale or auction - suggesting the run may be more limited than we imagine and genuinely the only people in possession are trusted and close - trusted enough even not to make copies for friends or even own up to having them. The people sitting on these must surely be aware of the rarity and desireability of these items - I'd go as far as to suggest they are some of the rarest musical releases in existence - certainly with comparible value than the most sought after Northern soul records. I'd hazard a guess that an original of something like hooper bay would fetch in excess of 10k.

[seanandcandy]

i dont think those old materials like Catalogue 3 or Acid memories really exists (but my sixth sense could be wrong...)

they really exist, they were confirmed in an interview that i'm sure someone with a better memory than mine could link you to

[audiotrack]

Someone on Twoism has gotta have them. no doubt.

I don't really know. If somebody on Twoism had them they'd probably have been leaked by now, I think.

I have been here a long time, and there's others here even earlier than that. Even though I'm not as active as I once was on these boards, I assure you if ANYONE on Twoism had copies of them we'd all know. Nice to dream, though....

How about this guy, statements from December 2010...viewtopic

I have heard at least 10, but was not told the names of them. Good stuff, even then.

Absolutely sure. Held the cassettes in my hand...hand written labels by the Sandisons. Should not share more than that...my apologies.

[Jakerpoo]

buckie high is great

[Distant Nebulus]

i might be wrong... (radiohead)

...but. isnt it possible that the 35 random tracks tape is actually the songs from catalogue 3. acid memories. closes vol1. play by numbers, and hooper bay?

i understand that not all the track times match up. but who the hell knows the track times if nobody actually holds the songs?

also. if you count the number of tracks on the unreleased albums, it totals 36. which means they could have def. been converted into the 35 random tracks tape.

I feel as though, 35 random track tape material is all demos and loops that where either used in past-completed tracks or as we've heard, in released material....I am about 70% confident that two of the unititled tracks from the ATP live set, are songs from hooper bay...and I would assume that the tracks on those rare albums, would be more complete in structure, judging by the sound of boc's album material..

[Jakerpoo]

who can really say? Who can know? Why do we care?

We're all just masturbating here on this forum... Not really focusing on reality, we're trying to create our own about Boards.

[mustbenice]

Trying to buy copies of the old releases would somehow feel wrong

This.

Especially for a large sum of money, which meant that the person who got rid of it did it not because they felt the fans should hear it or something like that, but merely because their material desire outweighs their value of the tape.

Also, I feel like a fan owning one of the tapes would be wrong as well. If one of them for some reason (any of the old releases) ever came into my possession, I think I'd rip the thing to FLAC and then mail the thing to Hexagon Sun where it really belongs. Simply because if it got lost or something and fell into someone else's possession, they may try to sell it for a whole bunch of money, which is the shittiest thing people could do...and have attempted to do in the past, in fact.

I don't see what's so shitty about it. If I understand correctly, the Old Tunes Tapes were pulled from ebay only because they were not the property of the person trying to sell them. If the would-be seller did own them fair and square, who really cares if they sell them for a lot of money or store them away in a closet for 40 years? What good do they do anybody by not being listened to? I think the band was more dismayed that music they didn't intend to release at that point (if ever) would be leaked. That somebody was making a few hundred bucks was probably mostly an afterthought, or else they'd have similar objections to the ridiculous after-market prices for any of their vinyl releases, the Geogaddi kaleidoscope, etc.

Would it be shitty if somebody they gave tapes to sold them for a decent enough fraction of what they'd make working in a year? Maybe, but I'd not feel bad about it for a second if the end result were the music leaking. If not for the drama that led to the Old Tunes Tapes showing up on ebay, we'd have never heard a bunch of great tracks. I'd pay for it in a heartbeat if given the opportunity. The band could have it up on bleep.com if they wanted to, and I'm sure people would be happy to pay for it.

I think reverence for the band's apparent wishes is somewhat misplaced considering how profoundly unconcerned they appear to be with the people who buy, listen to, and recommend their music. I'm sure they'd be kind of bummed out if old stuff leaked, but why should anyone care? How much harm would actually be done compared to how much happiness would result.

[PlacentaSand]

but why should anyone care? How much harm would actually be done compared to how much happiness would result.

I like the way you're thinking.

[Negamuse]

I don't really know. If somebody on Twoism had them they'd probably have been leaked by now, I think.

I have been here a long time, and there's others here even earlier than that. Even though I'm not as active as I once was on these boards, I assure you if ANYONE on Twoism had copies of them we'd all know. Nice to dream, though....

I agree. I think if not a rip then confirmed sighting of the items - photo's etc.

I've said this a few times but its not like I can claim it to be a "confirmed" sighting. But.

I'm reasonably sure that I've seen one copy of Play By Numbers in a small record shop in Derby - once - in the mid-to-late 90's. I remember being struck by the picture of the baby with the odd eyes, but AT THE TIME I wasn't into BoC at all, nor did I know what it was (rarity). This could have been at the time it was released but it might well have been a couple of years later. Unless this is a false memory that I've somehow managed to construct after the fact.

This coincided with the time I was massively obsessed with certain other electronic musicians with a number of aliases and being pre-internet and having fuck all to do I'd go round the same few shops in Notts and Derby quite regularly scouring the racks for releases from their alters. Back when there still WERE independent record shops.

So take that as you will. In a way, I almost hope I have dreamt that and somehow convinced myself it actually happened. You know, to think I could have bought it there and then! But yeah, as it stands I'm pretty sure this was a thing, no idea if it was a bootleg that had no business being there and had escaped or the genuine article. Unless someone can confirm that there's no way that it could have been real (ie, if there really was never an album called that, with that picture, or the "release" was better guarded than with the old tunes tapes) I still believe that's what I saw.

Edit: And just in case anyone thinks this is me trying to bullshit that I've seen something, trust me on this, that's not where I'm coming from and feel free to believe what you like.

[fujee]

Thats an interesting story, even if it wasn't genuine, someone went to the length of bootlegging it

[mustbenice]

Edit: And just in case anyone thinks this is me trying to bullshit that I've seen something, trust me on this, that's not where I'm coming from and feel free to believe what you like.

It's probably just a false memory. I've had almost exactly the same thing happen to me several times. When I was still in school, every once in a while, I would spend a day sifting through the complete stock of used record shops in the area. I don't remember specifics, but at least a handful of times, I had been convinced I had come across things that I later realized would have been completely impossible for me to have seen given the circumstances.

Thats an interesting story, even if it wasn't genuine, someone went to the length of bootlegging it

I thought it'd be funny to do that as a joke. I'd drop them at places like Goodwill to see if the fake tapes one day end up on what.cd.

[Elephant Face]

Dudes.

These were recorded and handed out, not distributed to retailers. I think that's a misconception some people might have.

I.E. There was never a barcode on any of these releases, and thus, no one would have ever seen one in a Record shop.

[fujee]

Just because there wasn't a barcode they could still be sold, especially in independant stores.

Also, yeah they were given out to friends, but who knows one of them could of had a spring clean and accidentally (or on purpose) thrown out one of the tapes with a whole loads of junk and not realised.

It's unlikely but its possible.

[23degreesdream]

Dudes.

These were recorded and handed out, not distributed to retailers. I think that's a misconception some people might have.

I.E. There was never a barcode on any of these releases, and thus, no one would have ever seen one in a Record shop.

My local independant record store often sold tapes and CD's by local and upcoming bands that were not 'official' chart-eligable releases, along with fanzines, white label dance records and stuff like that. Having said this, the chances of a tape turning up in a shop like this seems remote, especially one in the midlands, but you never know i suppose.

[polar sky]

Dudes.

These were recorded and handed out, not distributed to retailers. I think that's a misconception some people might have.

I.E. There was never a barcode on any of these releases, and thus, no one would have ever seen one in a Record shop.

My local independant record store often sold tapes and CD's by local and upcoming bands that were not 'official' chart-eligable releases, along with fanzines, white label dance records and stuff like that. Having said this, the chances of a tape turning up in a shop like this seems remote, especially one in the midlands, but you never know i suppose.

Mine too, I've sold my music in local record shops when I used to me in a band, they didn't need a barcode, only a price sticker.