Focus On The Spiral

[drillkicker]

I found this just now.


It was uploaded a year ago, and it's probably fake, but I don't know whether it's been ruled out on here yet. It sounds a lot like some old BoC, it's the same length as the track it claims to be, and it doesn't sound like any of the other old BoC tracks that I'm aware of. What do you guys think? I think if this is something made specifically as a fake, then whoever did this really nailed that old BoC sound.

[Skimming Stone]

I think this track has been mentioned a few times on here, with no one definitively ruling it out. The production sounds a bit too clean to me, but I like the track so I wouldn't mind it being real.

[drillkicker]

It doesn't sound clean at all to me. Perfectly matches the production on most of the R35 tape.

[Skimming Stone]

Well I haven't got the best ear for production anyway, just sounded it to me I think it would fit well with old BoC material also.

[MathIsMusic]

My hunch is that it's real . However, I have it on my music player in a mix I made called "Frags & Fakes".

[mr3]

http://www.twoism.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12681
http://www.twoism.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12436
http://www.twoism.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12436
http://www.twoism.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12087
http://www.twoism.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11456
Keep fighting the good fight. This just seemed familiar. I've got copies of the track dated from well before it was posted there. All are titled w/track 6, as if from Closes v1. Looks to be a fan like us posting old clips to Soundcloud and wondering what we're wondering.

[Skimming Stone]

I remember someone on one of those topics stating the track had been around since at least 2005, which makes it even more bizarre that we still know nothing of its authenticity. MDG is yet to come out and call it fake, even after all of these topics over it. Makes you wonder!

[Opothecary]

Godever (aka R35TT A14) floated around for years in the same manner, listed as "track 14" as if it was from Closes Vol. 1 (long before R35TT was a thing)

Knowing that, listen to them back to back...it's easy to see how they inhabit the same world.

[Jango9]

listed as "track 14" as if it was from Closes Vol. 1 (long before R35TT was a thing)

But isn't Godever Track 2 on Closes?

[Opothecary]

listed as "track 14" as if it was from Closes Vol. 1 (long before R35TT was a thing)

But isn't Godever Track 2 on Closes?

Sorry, I misremembered (my download of that version is long gone) - but in any case, I clearly remember the track number matched whatever you would have expected it to be on Closes Vol. 1. R35TT wasn't around yet, but the length/track # and just something about it all seemed right back then.

It started circulating about a year or two after the other RealAudio samples were posted on their official website. These were the early days of file sharing and part of me always thought the leak of this single track was just a laugh on their part and a way for them to see where and how far something like that would go with this new technology. No one really knew where this stuff was going and if I were them I'd treat it as some kind of a message in a bottle type of experiment.

Going back to listening to these side by side, it's easy to start picking out the other tracks on R35TT that tie into where they were at production wise (I guess I use the term loosely, the melody and songwriting is there, the instrumentation and production aren't quite) - I could listen to it all day, but you can almost see how they might not have a comfort level putting out this early work in its original sequencing.

R35TT's greatest strength is actually in how eclectic it is. It's all killer and no filler, and a big reason why is that it never lets the listener get stuck in a certain groove, it jumps around between the various genres and sounds that they've attributed to themselves in the late 80s/early 90s. Whatever it's doing at any given time, it never gets a chance to wear out its welcome and somehow it all just works.

When you start omitting the shoegaze-y stuff or tracks that sound like they could be outtakes from Twoism, it all starts to sound a little more primitive. I think if you compare the best parts of R35TT to the best parts of OT, R35TT seems to have more care put into the songs, OT has it beat in production values.

[HighScore]

Last year when I contacted MDG regarding the Closes Vol. 1 cover, I also asked about those songs from that Soundcloud page. MDG's response was:

I'm going to try to find out what these tracks are on SoundCloud - but I suspect they are fake, sorry.

After about a week I messaged him again and got no answer.

[Valotonin]

Last year when I contacted MDG regarding the Closes Vol. 1 cover, I also asked about those songs from that Soundcloud page. MDG's response was:

I'm going to try to find out what these tracks are on SoundCloud - but I suspect they are fake, sorry.

After about a week I messaged him again and got no answer.

This almost confirms it for me. Until MDG says otherwise I will believe.

I hope no one got their kneecaps broken bringing this to us though...

[vanlorne]

Last year when I contacted MDG regarding the Closes Vol. 1 cover, I also asked about those songs from that Soundcloud page. MDG's response was:

I'm going to try to find out what these tracks are on SoundCloud - but I suspect they are fake, sorry.

After about a week I messaged him again and got no answer.

This almost confirms it for me. Until MDG says otherwise I will believe.

I hope no one got their kneecaps broken bringing this to us though...

Confirms what?

[Torn n Frayed]

Confirms what?

It's real.

[vanlorne]

Confirms what?

It's real.

Is that the consensus? Just because MDG didnt reply a second time?

[mr3]

Sorry, I misremembered (my download of that version is long gone) - but in any case, I clearly remember the track number matched whatever you would have expected it to be on Closes Vol. 1. R35TT wasn't around yet, but the length/track # and just something about it all seemed right back then.

It started circulating about a year or two after the other RealAudio samples were posted on their official website. These were the early days of file sharing and part of me always thought the leak of this single track was just a laugh on their part and a way for them to see where and how far something like that would go with this new technology. No one really knew where this stuff was going and if I were them I'd treat it as some kind of a message in a bottle type of experiment.

Going back to listening to these side by side, it's easy to start picking out the other tracks on R35TT that tie into where they were at production wise (I guess I use the term loosely, the melody and songwriting is there, the instrumentation and production aren't quite) - I could listen to it all day, but you can almost see how they might not have a comfort level putting out this early work in its original sequencing.

R35TT's greatest strength is actually in how eclectic it is. It's all killer and no filler, and a big reason why is that it never lets the listener get stuck in a certain groove, it jumps around between the various genres and sounds that they've attributed to themselves in the late 80s/early 90s. Whatever it's doing at any given time, it never gets a chance to wear out its welcome and somehow it all just works.

When you start omitting the shoegaze-y stuff or tracks that sound like they could be outtakes from Twoism, it all starts to sound a little more primitive. I think if you compare the best parts of R35TT to the best parts of OT, R35TT seems to have more care put into the songs, OT has it beat in production values.

Speak of the devil I was just listening to it. Man how great is that thing? It always floors me, the places they were exploring during that timeframe just hit home for me. The music affects me like nothing else can. It's hard not to want to plead for them to release it all. By the way, gave me an idea--a by-the-ears chronological tracklist.

And the mystery surrounding it is like the best cherry on top. MDG's "just a mixture" comment forced the question: if it wasn't them then...how?! Where the heck did it come from? Who the heck put it together? They obviously had (most? all? more than?) the unreleased material we know about, so seems like it'd have to be someone very close to them. Yet the bros don't know who. And I'm guessing they did some digging on their own, that had to feel like being exposed. And why--if whoever it was had that much of the music right in their hands--why did they sniff too much airplane glue and decide to mix the tracks, almost as if to try to match the Old Tunes tapes style? Did they not know what they had in their hands?

Anyway no, your memory and what you were saying w/r/t A14 being labeled Godever for a long while and the mixup w/Closes matches everyone else's. It just got confusing way later (last year) when people started calling 'She is P' Godever without admitting they had no real reason to...maybe just to 'give the ego a good lubrication' as Richard would say.

[Skimming Stone]

It just got confusing way later (last year) when people started calling 'She is P' Godever without admitting they had no real reason to...

I don't really understand why someone uploaded She is P under the name Godever to Youtube last year. It's not convincing when we already know the track title...

[warphead]

Cheers for posting this back up drillkicker.

I love The BOC but pull the chord before entering the Sandisonstratosphere, hence this is new to me.

I'm not schooled enough to say yay or nay, though my primal instincts lean towards the yay.

[Opothecary]

Speak of the devil I was just listening to it. Man how great is that thing? It always floors me, the places they were exploring during that timeframe just hit home for me. The music affects me like nothing else can. It's hard not to want to plead for them to release it all. By the way, gave me an idea--a by-the-ears chronological tracklist.

And the mystery surrounding it is like the best cherry on top. MDG's "just a mixture" comment forced the question: if it wasn't them then...how?! Where the heck did it come from? Who the heck put it together? They obviously had (most? all? more than?) the unreleased material we know about, so seems like it'd have to be someone very close to them. Yet the bros don't know who. And I'm guessing they did some digging on their own, that had to feel like being exposed. And why--if whoever it was had that much of the music right in their hands--why did they sniff too much airplane glue and decide to mix the tracks, almost as if to try to match the Old Tunes tapes style? Did they not know what they had in their hands?

Anyway no, your memory and what you were saying w/r/t A14 being labeled Godever for a long while and the mixup w/Closes matches everyone else's. It just got confusing way later (last year) when people started calling 'She is P' Godever without admitting they had no real reason to...maybe just to 'give the ego a good lubrication' as Richard would say.

Most people pick apart Geogaddi, R35TT is my Geogaddi. It would be fun to guess at the chronology. Aside from the tracks on there that appear on the 2 OT volumes or later releases, I'm kind of operating on the assumption that about 20 tracks are from Closes Vol. 1 and earlier. I'm sure there's at least a few of those that come from something that we don't even know about.

These are my personal predictions about the rest:

Acid Memories

A10 ?
A13 ?

Play by Numbers

A07 - Infinite Lines of Colourful Sevens ?
B04 - Echelon ?
B14 ?

Hooper Bay

B02 ?
B12 - Geyser ?

It would be great to hear the story behind this tape someday, but would we even believe it if we did? It's too bad the same person never released a followup "mixture". I think it was compiled to mimic OT, but cutting some tracks short here and there so people couldn't guess what all of them are. If they didn't leak it themselves to be "mysterious" I've always thought it was a compromise to share some of that music with the fanbase without outing the compiler and what the music actually is.

If BoC were to release it themselves, I'd love for them to follow the same format that they used with OT and whatever was done with R35TT. Give people the base to build their own (almost) complete early releases but sequence it in an interesting way across years/eras and let people do what they want to do via playlists or whatever. Leave out a few tracks here and there like Christ. did with his Curio compilations to keep the originals special to the handful of people who have them, if they must.

Their early work has been my white whale for almost 20 years, it would be nice to get MOST of it, but I understand the value of keeping some mystery alive for their fans and something special for their friends and family. I understand if they don't want to do it, or if its some kind of nest egg for their kids to do with as they please at some point in the future. Maybe this stuff will pay for university in another 5 or 10 years!

[Jango9]

Play by Numbers

A07 - Infinite Lines of Colourful Sevens ?
B04 - Echelon ?
B14 ?

Speaking of B04, a little while ago I came across this on some shady MP3 site:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/jrtolrafxyt3z ... r.mp3?dl=1

The artifacts don't seem to match any version of B04 we have so far and the fade actually finishes rather than cutting early like the R35TT version, but until I see the rest of the EP show up I'm putting this down to being another fake. Didn't even bring it up at the time since the evidence against authenticity far outweighs that for it.

As for the others, B14 sounds closer to Acid Memories both in terms of production and how the sound's been described (guitars meet electronics, embryonic sound). The same source described Play By Numbers as shifting farther in both directions. A07 definitely fits the shoegaze/wall of noise sound that PBN is known for, though it's more likely to be Echelon than Infinite Lines (which many have speculated is actually a longer A08 because some review described them very similarly).