(Theory) Why haven't the mystery albums been released yet?

[Jango9]

This is mainly in response to the speculation about the BoCset in another thread, I made this new one so as to not derail the old one.

Cosmic Manta and I were putting forth a lot of thought, and we think we've pinpointed the main reason why M&M aren't big fans of the old tapes. In several interviews, they've said how much the use of computers in composing music irks them, they've also expressed distaste for how much modern music sounds so "perfect, rationalized, and bland".

With that in mind listen to the Old Tunes tapes, especially volume 2. Notice how much more step sequencing is involved than on their later albums. Although it seems like every track has at least one part that's played live, there's definitely a more "calculated" element to most of them than the songs that came later. Drum patterns and rhythms were much more simple and didn't evolve as much throughout the tracks as they did on the later albums. I'm not saying this is a bad thing as they all still sound pretty excellent (except for The Way You Show), but it's still something to take notice of.

Also notice how the old tunes that ended up on BoC Maxima (except for maybe Rodox) are the ones that are lacking that "calculated" element. Both Hi Scores and BoC Maxima were billed as "the best of the early years", so that's a pretty big clue right there. According to the liner notes on AFOT and OTV2, everything on those tapes dates to around the same time as the five mystery albums. Some apparently date back as much as 2 years earlier than Catalog 3's release if OTV2's liner notes are to be believed. Also notice how everything on Side A of OTV2 sounds noticeably older both production wise and in terms of how much it deviates from the standard BoC sound (Side B sounds a lot more like AFOT).

Stepping into the Random 35 Track Tape territory, pretty much every track on there has that same "calculated" element that I mentioned earlier. We already have some evidence that A06 is 5D (The youtube upload in BoC's favorites) and A14 is Godever (leaked with that titled years before the rest of the R35TT, plus both match up time-wise). It's pretty safe to assume that this is a compilation of early works with that in mind, especially given the presence of AFOT tracks. On A06 and A14 (possibly others), the instruments don't sound that far off from those used on OTV2, and indeed they share the same type of laconic flows that appear all throughout both volumes of Old Tunes and that BoC have shown themselves to not be particularly fond of. The same could be said of B04 (Numerator?), so if these are indeed what the early albums sound like then these laconic flows are probably the main reason why they haven't seen a wide release. Some bands choose to hide their early work because it's rather messy, I think BoC are hiding theirs because it's too clean for their (notoriously perfectionist) standards.

I personally think the old tunes are still (for the most part) fucking brilliant, if some more unreleased material were to ever get a proper release you'd better believe I'd be all over it (and so would most of you, for that matter).

[drillkicker]

I feel like the Sandisons have some secret detestation for the Autechre guys. It's kind of unfortunate that they would constantly insult every central belief held by the very individuals responsible for their success…

That said, anyone who dislikes computer music obviously hasn't found out the endless joy that is Max/MSP. And if the brothers think that A06 isn't one of the "best of" the early years, then I'm sorry but they just have shit taste in BoC.

[Skimming Stone]

I feel like the Sandisons have some secret detestation for the Autechre guys.

I have no opinion in regards to that statement, but I will say I found it quite funny in the ae AMA that one of the guys said his favourite BoC track was a track from Old Tunes vol 2

[drillkicker]

I feel like the Sandisons have some secret detestation for the Autechre guys.

I have no opinion in regards to that statement, but I will say I found it quite funny in the ae AMA that one of the guys said his favourite BoC track was a track from Old Tunes vol 2

And it also happens to be the song that was completely ripping off Mort Garson's style. The chord progression does sound kind of Autechrian, though.

[Valotonin]

I agree with your initial statement. I think the means and money to buy analogue hardware may have been a problem and also the fact that the obsession with decaying soundwaves and making organic music must have been a gradually growing process for them as musicians. Also it would probably be too much of an obvious peek in to their 'trade secrets' in terms of music production hearing new equipment gradually get introduced and hearing musical experiments slowly take form.

[zeoevil]

They are being saved for their kids to release after their deaths. They've said as much in interviews. Also, they probably mostly suck.

[drillkicker]

Also, they probably mostly suck.

Not true at all if the leaked tapes and short previews are anything to go by.

[zeoevil]

Also, they probably mostly suck.

Not true at all if the leaked tapes and short previews are anything to go by.

Hence, why I said "probably mostly suck" and not "most definitely suck." There is probably a chance most of the old material isn't very good in the eyes of the band. I suppose I could draw a parallel to how Rob Brown said he couldn't listen to Amber because he thought it was cheesy. So I will rephrase my post as an on-topic theory. Perhaps the band considers the majority of their unreleased material to be cheesy and below the standards they've set for themselves since then.

[Jango9]

Perhaps the band considers the majority of their unreleased material to be cheesy and below the standards they've set for themselves since then.

So basically exactly what I said in the OP?

[zeoevil]

Perhaps the band considers the majority of their unreleased material to be cheesy and below the standards they've set for themselves since then.

So basically exactly what I said in the OP?

I got the impression you thought the old material wasn't being released because it was good not bad.

[Jango9]

I got the impression you thought the old material wasn't being released because it was good not bad.

I was trying to say that it was too neat and tidy, which by BoC's standards basically translates to what you said.

[zeoevil]

I got the impression you thought the old material wasn't being released because it was good not bad.

I was trying to say that it was too neat and tidy, which by BoC's standards basically translates to what you said.

Fair enough. I was trying to say that perhaps they think it's shit. As in Star Trek phasers in it shit.

[re-phaelam-ed]

i always thought that that stuff would never get released as there are SO many sampled bits in there....to pay to get them all released just wouldn't be worth it.

[Skimming Stone]

i always thought that that stuff would never get released as there are SO many sampled bits in there....to pay to get them all released just wouldn't be worth it.

Well it's a strange one, because while the Old Tunes tapes contain quite a lot of samples, the r35tt contains virtually one. I'm more inclined to think the mystery albums sound similar to the r35tt honestly. Who knows, maybe some of the albums contain plenty of samples, while others don't contain any.

[everythingyoudoisorange]

kinda unrelated, but since we're talking Autechre, is it lame I went to go see them live mostly because of their history with BoC, discovering them through their demo they sent out to labels and signing them on SKAM? I like a few Autechre tracks but I liked the openers more, honestly.

I live vicariously through artists who have worked with BoC in some manner.

Love TV on the Radio, but chalk that up as a "degree of Kevin BoC-an" as well when I saw them live and Beck too.

[drillkicker]

kinda unrelated, but since we're talking Autechre, is it lame I went to go see them live mostly because of their history with BoC, discovering them through their demo they sent out to labels and signing them on SKAM? I like a few Autechre tracks but I liked the openers more, honestly.

Yes, that is lame. Autechre's music is definitely superior to BoC's.

[zeoevil]

Autechre's music is definitely superior to BoC's.

[drillkicker]

Autechre's music is definitely superior to BoC's.

It is, though. There is no music artist currently active who is as innovative as Autechre. The level of detail they put into their creations is mindblowing.

[Opothecary]

Autechre better than BoC? I don't know about that but everyone has their own taste.

I'd say that based on R35TT their other unreleased work from that time seems to be mature than what we got on Old Tunes. If it were up to them, none of this music would be out there. They just happened to shop OT around as an accompanying demo with Maxima so it fell into the wrong hands which is why we have it. It's availability doesn't mean it's better than what we haven't heard. Old Tunes seems like a mix of really old stuff they did when they were kids, music that never fully developed and a few legitimate classics mixed in to wash it all down.

[d e n]

c'mon!

it would be really sad for twoism to enter to the realm of boc<ae<boc dialogues