"Evidence for a Young Earth"

[number-six]

As i'm new to the forum (hello by the way!), I tried to follow proper guidelines and do a search on this subject before I went ahead and nothing so i'll just leap into it. In my ever increasing curiosity about this band, and having recently discovered both bocpages and twoism, i've recently read through each of MDG's posts to attempt to better understand the facts of BoC's ongoing timeline. There are some fascinating threads around here, and we all know that one of the most influential posters here, by sheer virtue of his connections, is MDG.

I found one post he made in 2011 linking to this site:

http://www.earthage.org/youngearthev/ev ... Atmosphere

At the time there was only one reply, made by Mexicola if I remember rightly, that appeared both interested and sarcastic. Other than that, pretty much no comment or analysis of this strange posting seem to show up.

I've just realised that I may be being incredibly daft in some way and missing something, like perhaps this link was MDG himself being sarcastic or being parodic in some way. I thought that now following the release of Tomorrow's Harvest, this site may hold some clue on specifically the narrative of the record. I don't think that this site is full of easter eggs or secrets that will lead us to a new album hidden buried under cat shite in Bulgaria (like some theories resemble), but I think it was an influence or inspiration on Tomorrow's Harvest and is interesting to consider when constructing our own stories and tales around TH. What are your thoughts? I think there is some interesting, although ludicrously unscientific, imagery on the page, and could it in anyway link conceptually with New Clear Dawn?

I'm not interested in trying to create a myth or look into something where there is nothing, but I honestly believe that this may have been a source of inspiration in some way to their future vision.

[northernlite]

As i'm new to the forum (hello by the way!), I tried to follow proper guidelines and do a search on this subject before I went ahead and nothing so i'll just leap into it. In my ever increasing curiosity about this band, and having recently discovered both bocpages and twoism, i've recently read through each of MDG's posts to attempt to better understand the facts of BoC's ongoing timeline. There are some fascinating threads around here, and we all know that one of the most influential posters here, by sheer virtue of his connections, is MDG.

I found one post he made in 2011 linking to this site:

http://www.earthage.org/youngearthev/ev ... Atmosphere

At the time there was only one reply, made by Mexicola if I remember rightly, that appeared both interested and sarcastic. Other than that, pretty much no comment or analysis of this strange posting seem to show up.

I've just realised that I may be being incredibly daft in some way and missing something, like perhaps this link was MDG himself being sarcastic or being parodic in some way. I thought that now following the release of Tomorrow's Harvest, this site may hold some clue on specifically the narrative of the record. I don't think that this site is full of easter eggs or secrets that will lead us to a new album hidden buried under cat shite in Bulgaria (like some theories resemble), but I think it was an influence or inspiration on Tomorrow's Harvest and is interesting to consider when constructing our own stories and tales around TH. What are your thoughts? I think there is some interesting, although ludicrously unscientific, imagery on the page, and could it in anyway link conceptually with New Clear Dawn?

I'm not interested in trying to create a myth or look into something where there is nothing, but I honestly believe that this may have been a source of inspiration in some way to their future vision.

Interesting... Can you link the post you refer to?

[number-six]

Of course! Silly me, I should have in the first place.

http://www.twoism.org/forum/viewtopic.p ... 61#p154261

[number-six]

Following Kinski and Mexicola's response, there's no acknowledgement of this pretty much! Thought it was quite striking and fits into Tomorrow's Harvest's atmosphere rather spookily. Apologies for double post.

[Ectonaut]

My guess is that the link hosts zero clues whatsoever on a BoC album, but this creationist nonsense (yes, I am a geologist) and this desperate grasping for clues, the 'want to believe' misinterpretation of information, and the tendency to cook up big stories based on little to no facts at all - all perfectly mirror the level of some discussions on this forum regarding BoC doings and agendas.

[number-six]

My guess is that the link hosts zero clues whatsoever on a BoC album, but this creationist nonsense (yes, I am a geologist) and this desperate grasping for clues, the 'want to believe' misinterpretation of information, and the tendency to cook up big stories based on little to no facts at all - all perfectly mirror the level of some discussions on this forum regarding BoC doings and agendas.

That's an interesting parallel, but why make your point with such a specific and random site? If you're talking about me personally, i've already stated that I don't think this link has anything BoC related whatsoever, my inititial thought was that the site was somehow a narrative influence and nothing more. I thought it was a question worth asking considering how everything else is nitpicked. I'm a science loving sceptic and despise reading into things where there is nothing - i'm not doing that. I'm asking a question I hadn't felt had been asked yet.

I think making your point with a website as a metaphor and nothing more would make MDG a pretentious piece of shit. He's never come across that way.

EDIT: Tomorrow's Harvest clearly has a narrative. I've come to believe more and more that this narrative is a lot more objective than we think.

[number-six]

Oh, and despite this being a double post, i'm a lifelong atheist but find the religious twinges in BoC's music to be fascinating and endearing. I don't think these kinds of creationist theories are too far off their radars or even out of the realm of being good inspiration for imagery.

[Mexicola]

Wow, I really was on a sarcasm trip that day! Jeez, moderately embarrassing. Lol.

[number-six]

Wow, I really was on a sarcasm trip that day! Jeez, moderately embarrassing. Lol.

The tone of the thread led you that way, Mexicola! I, for one, certainly don't judge. One thing to add whilst replying is that, as a total newbie reading through things compressed and with the advantage of hindsight, MDG has NEVER posted anything of total irrelevance or devoid of any interest. This post sticks out like a sore thumb, and so does the lack of any notice of it. I just thought it far too interesting not to bring up, and I still do.

[Mexicola]

Quite. Still cant work out if its him playing a joke ot not? Hmmm. Interesting though,glad you reminded me. Cheers!

[zeoevil]

I'm not interested in trying to create a myth or look into something where there is nothing, but I honestly believe that this may have been a source of inspiration in some way to their future vision.

I suppose as youth they might have been mislead into believing things (From One Source All Things Depend) that they no longer believe as adults (Nothing Is Real).

[number-six]

I'm not interested in trying to create a myth or look into something where there is nothing, but I honestly believe that this may have been a source of inspiration in some way to their future vision.

I suppose as youth they might have been mislead into believing things (From One Source All Things Depend) that they no longer believe as adults (Nothing Is Real).

It's not even I think that they believe it. I'd be very disappointed in BoC fans if they genuinely thought the Scottish duo believe in gods with horns or the like. They don't believe it, but some of the imagery can be a stark influence.

[zeoevil]

It's not even I think that they believe it. I'd be very disappointed in BoC fans if they genuinely thought the Scottish duo believe in gods with horns or the like. They don't believe it, but some of the imagery can be a stark influence.

I wasn't implying they do, but they were obviously exposed to religious material as children and may have been, or are, religious individuals themselves. Track 6 on Warp10 is a reversed Psalm. Consider the source material for songs like Amo Bishop Roden, From One Source All Things Depend, Nothing Is Real, Breaking Nehushtan, and David Came to Mahana'im. Do you think you would know what Mahanaim or Nehushtan were if you didn't read the Bible or go to church? If you were a historian or a BoC fan, maybe. I could see that, but not otherwise. Also, the Devil is lightweight.

[number-six]

It's not even I think that they believe it. I'd be very disappointed in BoC fans if they genuinely thought the Scottish duo believe in gods with horns or the like. They don't believe it, but some of the imagery can be a stark influence.

I wasn't implying they do, but they were obviously exposed to religious material as children and may have been, or are, religious individuals themselves. Track 6 on Warp10 is a reversed Psalm. Consider the source material for songs like Amo Bishop Roden, From One Source All Things Depend, Nothing Is Real, Breaking Nehushtan, and David Came to Mahana'im. Do you think you would know what Mahanaim or Nehushtan were if you didn't read the Bible or go to church? If you were a historian or a BoC fan, maybe. I could see that, but not otherwise. Also, the Devil is lightweight.

Certainly if South Park is anything to go by. But you're right of course, they've clearly had more than a passing connection with religion - it's something that's always seemed obvious. It appears we're actually agreeing with each other as we're both saying these sources are obviously important to the boys. I personally, although i've only skated the site, find that it fits oddly with my own narrative of the album but (rightly so) only tells part of the story. I've always seen the record as describing various rises and falls, peaks and troughs, in population and culture. Specifically, I feel TH covers one rise and one fall, which can be viewed in reverse or from several other different perspectives while painting the same picture (i think the idea of the palindrome is far more important than fans may consider). What I think is interesting in this "Evidence for a Young Earth" isn't the literal idea of the Planet Earth being 6,000 years old or less, but rather the implication that society is far younger than we thought and we may not have the ability to see into past "rises and falls". While this is untrue of our real world in current time, could this not be a possible prophetic vision of the future? Could there be numerous iterations of human existence popping up and out onwards through the Earth's lifespan, never quite reaching the zenith of evolution to leave our celestial prison and become something greater? Are we stuck in nothing? In that sense, indeed, nothing is real.

I know I went off on a tangent there, but these ridiculous religious scribblings brought to light by a known BoC insider have certainly influenced me, if not the Scottish lads themselves.

I also admit than more than a couple of illegal smokes may have influenced me, but considering my line of thinking has been the same since TH's release I at least feel more confident in my ramblings.

One Final Very Important Thought:
What if static-laced transmissions in the ether were all that was left of these various pockets of humanity throughout the future? What if all we were left with were numbers and codes left anonymously in radiowaves? Could the Telepath have figured out this oscillating nature to existence, and be attempting to leave the next rise a message or a clue - recorded in his zeitgeist's death-rattles, expressed in distant explosions?

Yes, I know, I OVERFLOW MAN - but my god was that a catharsis.

[number-six]

It's not even I think that they believe it. I'd be very disappointed in BoC fans if they genuinely thought the Scottish duo believe in gods with horns or the like. They don't believe it, but some of the imagery can be a stark influence.

I wasn't implying they do, but they were obviously exposed to religious material as children and may have been, or are, religious individuals themselves. Track 6 on Warp10 is a reversed Psalm. Consider the source material for songs like Amo Bishop Roden, From One Source All Things Depend, Nothing Is Real, Breaking Nehushtan, and David Came to Mahana'im. Do you think you would know what Mahanaim or Nehushtan were if you didn't read the Bible or go to church? If you were a historian or a BoC fan, maybe. I could see that, but not otherwise. Also, the Devil is lightweight.

Certainly if South Park is anything to go by. But you're right of course, they've clearly had more than a passing connection with religion - it's something that's always seemed obvious. It appears we're actually agreeing with each other as we're both saying these sources are obviously important to the boys. I personally, although i've only skated the site, find that it fits oddly with my own narrative of the album but (rightly so) only tells part of the story. I've always seen the record as describing various rises and falls, peaks and troughs, in population and culture. Specifically, I feel TH covers one rise and one fall, which can be viewed in reverse or from several other different perspectives while painting the same picture (i think the idea of the palindrome is far more important than fans may consider). What I think is interesting in this "Evidence for a Young Earth" isn't the literal idea of the Planet Earth being 6,000 years old or less, but rather the implication that society is far younger than we thought and we may not have the ability to see into past "rises and falls". While this is untrue of our real world in current time, could this not be a possible prophetic vision of the future? Could there be numerous iterations of human existence popping up and out onwards through the Earth's lifespan, never quite reaching the zenith of evolution to leave our celestial prison and become something greater? Are we stuck in nothing? In that sense, indeed, nothing is real.

I know I went off on a tangent there, but these ridiculous religious scribblings brought to light by a known BoC insider have certainly influenced me, if not the Scottish lads themselves.

I also admit that more than a couple of illegal smokes may have influenced me, but considering my line of thinking has been the same since TH's release I at least feel more confident in my ramblings.

One Final Very Important Thought:
What if static-laced transmissions in the ether were all that was left of these various pockets of humanity throughout the future? What if all we that remained were numbers and codes slotted anonymously into radiowaves? Could the Telepath have figured out this oscillating nature to existence, and be attempting to leave the next rise a message or a clue - recorded in his zeitgeist's death-rattles, expressed in distant explosions?

Yes, I know, I OVERFLOW MAN - but my god was that a catharsis.

[northernlite]

It's not even I think that they believe it. I'd be very disappointed in BoC fans if they genuinely thought the Scottish duo believe in gods with horns or the like. They don't believe it, but some of the imagery can be a stark influence.

I wasn't implying they do, but they were obviously exposed to religious material as children and may have been, or are, religious individuals themselves. Track 6 on Warp10 is a reversed Psalm. Consider the source material for songs like Amo Bishop Roden, From One Source All Things Depend, Nothing Is Real, Breaking Nehushtan, and David Came to Mahana'im. Do you think you would know what Mahanaim or Nehushtan were if you didn't read the Bible or go to church? If you were a historian or a BoC fan, maybe. I could see that, but not otherwise. Also, the Devil is lightweight.

Certainly if South Park is anything to go by. But you're right of course, they've clearly had more than a passing connection with religion - it's something that's always seemed obvious. It appears we're actually agreeing with each other as we're both saying these sources are obviously important to the boys. I personally, although i've only skated the site, find that it fits oddly with my own narrative of the album but (rightly so) only tells part of the story. I've always seen the record as describing various rises and falls, peaks and troughs, in population and culture. Specifically, I feel TH covers one rise and one fall, which can be viewed in reverse or from several other different perspectives while painting the same picture (i think the idea of the palindrome is far more important than fans may consider). What I think is interesting in this "Evidence for a Young Earth" isn't the literal idea of the Planet Earth being 6,000 years old or less, but rather the implication that society is far younger than we thought and we may not have the ability to see into past "rises and falls". While this is untrue of our real world in current time, could this not be a possible prophetic vision of the future? Could there be numerous iterations of human existence popping up and out onwards through the Earth's lifespan, never quite reaching the zenith of evolution to leave our celestial prison and become something greater? Are we stuck in nothing? In that sense, indeed, nothing is real.

I know I went off on a tangent there, but these ridiculous religious scribblings brought to light by a known BoC insider have certainly influenced me, if not the Scottish lads themselves.

I also admit than more than a couple of illegal smokes may have influenced me, but considering my line of thinking has been the same since TH's release I at least feel more confident in my ramblings.

One Final Very Important Thought:
What if static-laced transmissions in the ether were all that was left of these various pockets of humanity throughout the future? What if all we were left with were numbers and codes left anonymously in radiowaves? Could the Telepath have figured out this oscillating nature to existence, and be attempting to leave the next rise a message or a clue - recorded in his zeitgeist's death-rattles, expressed in distant explosions?

Yes, I know, I OVERFLOW MAN - but my god was that a catharsis.

I like reading what you have to say, glad you're here.

[number-six]

I like reading what you have to say, glad you're here.

An extreme honour to hear as a longtime lurker well entertained by this forum consistently.

[Opothecary]

OT especially seems to indicate that Christianity played some role in their upbringing, but who knows if that's something that's held. Growing up in rural Scotland, it seems like it would potentially be an influential part of their upbringing and probably informs some of their nostalgia regardless of how they feel about it now. I think the European brand of it is a little less fire and brimstone and loathsome and judgmental compared to the American flavor at times, for what it's worth.

I'm personally a little more Nothing is Real than Heysanna Hosanna at this point in my life, but I remember my best friend who lived across the street growing up had a very Christian upbringing, graduated high school, ended up eating a lot of acid and became a glass blower and joined a jam band, so you never know. I'm sure if you asked, these same types of things would be remembrances of his childhood too.

[Fredd-E]

Of course! Silly me, I should have in the first place.

http://www.twoism.org/forum/viewtopic.p ... 61#p154261

Aha! I missed that one apparently. I did not list it here: http://bocpages.org/wiki/Statements_from_Hexagon_Sun

But it's not really a statement either so dunno...

[arvy]

My guess is that the link hosts zero clues whatsoever on a BoC album, but this creationist nonsense (yes, I am a geologist) and this desperate grasping for clues, the 'want to believe' misinterpretation of information, and the tendency to cook up big stories based on little to no facts at all - all perfectly mirror the level of some discussions on this forum regarding BoC doings and agendas.

Brilliant reply to a really cool thread,

that's how I feel about the album actually, it's very honest, but it's also could turn to a cold and sarcastic in a moment,